Forum:Let's try something new
Now, I know this is going to sound a bit "radical", so bear with me. However, I think it's time the admins work with the users' ideas. While we can't give the users sypsop rights, we can take away our own. What if for one week all of the admins (Not the crats, just the admins) lose their administrator powers and duties, and do almost all mainspace editing. I think this would help the admins understand where the users are coming from when they vote, and this could begin what I would like to call "The new age" where the site is back running like before, during what Nighthawk leader calls "The golden age". Let's here some comments, Supports and Opposes, and maybe other ideas on what we can do here... Ok, let's just brainstorm a bit on how the users can get along better. I want to see people giving opinions, comments, ideas, etc. ::Support..? Sounds like it could work..but maybe we should keep ONE admin, in case something goes wrong? Neutral- I think it should be up to the individual admin if they want to participate in it. And I oppose removing b'crat or checkuser rights, as that requires requesting it from staff to disable, then re-enable again, and I can't really see an extremely good reason for it. We need people around to block vandals and delete pages as usual though. I support having a week of mainly mainspace, but I don't know about having less people able to stop vandalism. 00:33, May 28, 2011 (UTC) Oppose. There is no need to do this. I could write a twenty page essay on how this is not needed, pointless, and will ultimately accomplish nothing. I know that I won't have any different outlook on editing after a week of no access to the tools, all that this will do is create a week of us not having enough admins, during which vandalism and other naughty things will no doubt get out of hand. Also, again, you seem to imply that there is some sort of difference between admins and users when in fact there is none. If I've missed something, please let me know. 00:34, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :Also, and this really brings out the liberal in me, but why are we trying to go back to the good old days? If something is broken now, let's fix it, but looking to the past for answers is hardly a solution. Back then, we had about a third the users we have now. Times have changed, and we need to as well. As nice as it is to live in the past, there is no magic reset button, sadly, and I'd say that a week of no admins definitely isn't that reset button. 00:38, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::Moaaaaar :D Something that might work to the same effect, though, is sysopping a few more people. I have three or four people in mind who I'm sure would use the tools well, but I don't want to nominate them if I'm going to be flooded with "we have enough admins". There is no limit to the number of admins we can have (the more the merrier, actually), and so maybe having more people get access to the tools would be a good thing, especially in terms of debunking the idea of adminship being something special. 00:43, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :mmkay, @Nighthawk: We would still let the Bcrats keep their rights for deletions, spam, etc. so you could re-admin us lol. and @Ajr, I knew you would oppose this. I am kinda shocked you don't see the problems here between the users and the admins. The problems exist, and I am not living in the past, I'm looking towards the future. Just because you have alot more Wiki-wide experience doesn't mean you can take over forums like this. You aren't the king (despite the crown in your avatar) and I think this idea could help. It is something new and different, and should at least be considered. Do you think this site is looking good right now? from the outside, yes. But when you log in, you see that issue at hand. I am not living in the past, and will not look back. Rather, we move forward! ONWARD! :P - 01:50, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::Here here! :::I see many problems between users - and yes, there are some admin/user conflicts, but no more than there are user/user conflicts. I think that you are taking this from the wrong stance, saying that we should only fix the admin/user part and not the user/user. I say again, no difference between admins and users.... I'm more than open to trying to solve the problem of poor inter-user relationships, something which comes with being a large wiki, but as I said I don't think that this will solve anything. :::Also, I have every right to "take over the forum like this" (expressing my opinion), as does everyone else on the wiki. And the crown in my avatar represents my current rank in the Royal Canadian Sea Cadets (Petty Officer 1st Class). 02:12, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::::Ok, so you see the problem here. I really don't care how we solve these problems (To be honest, I kinda just threw this idea out there so we can get something started), as long as they're solved then I'm happy. You do admit that there are problems existing, and that should be enough for you to want them to be fixed. While it may sound stupid, this idea is a good start for some brainstorming. It gets you thinking, and I see that you guys are uniting in hating the idea. So I think that's a plus.. ;) I just think this site shouldn't go from good to bad. The site has grown, and we've got more users. Conflict will exist, but these issues should be resolved, not just sweeped under the rug. and gawd, I sound kinda drunk...Point is, these conflicts should be resolved, and the way they are being handled is not working. Shouldn't we try something new? Nothing wrong with being different. :) - 02:30, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :::::Something new might work, but ultimately, I'm not sure how to get users to be nicer to each other. That is really something determined on an individual basis. I suppose we could start blocking people for incivility, but that would cause more issues that what it would fix. I am open to ideas, though, provided that they don't leave the wiki next to defenceless for a week :P 02:33, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::::::Agreed, then we can scratch this idea off the list. But if you're willing to work with me on this one, and we can somehow find a way so that the users and admins get along and can have debates (as opposed to arguments), then I'll be happy. It can be done if you just....BELIEVE! ;) Point here? We can do it! - 02:35, May 28, 2011 (UTC) Strong Oppose: The darn idea is pointless. Oh, and are you supporters ready for vandalism? "Maybe we could keep on Bureaucrat" -- Eh Wha? It's not like NHL or CJC is ready to delete unwanted, Fanon, nonsense pages popping up all day.:P If this rule goes into effect, I am not going to abide by it. Block me; who cares. I'm concerned for the stability, reputation, etc. for this Wiki. 02:00, May 28, 2011 (UTC) Neutral Personally, I feel this might work, but I agree with Tat on how it might compromise the wiki. This is my suggestion: why don't we adopt some policy that gives an incentive for users to be nice to each other? For example, is it possible to create some sort of badge for being nice? Since some users only do stuff for badges, this might motivate them to be kind to each other. Scratch that. The respect's not genuine... I know! How about a policy for promoting kindness to one another? For example, I've never warned any wayward user with a warning template; I've always typed out what their errors are and what they could do to improve. Also, I feel that perhaps we all might need some patience. After all, this is only a wiki, and we don't need to get all flustered over internet stuff. Man, I'll think of something more later on... 02:46, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :Exactly what I'm talking about, we just need to brainstorm a bit here. Stuff like this can work ^ :) - 02:50, May 28, 2011 (UTC) *Per Fudgepie. It's not like we Admins are cabals. I would definitely support if so.:P This policy is too "Drastic"; we should all work on a policy that we all can agree on. 02:57, May 28, 2011 (UTC) *'Comment' If vandals here about this, they would take advantage of the Admin-les period. That could be bad. 06:28, May 28, 2011 (UTC) Oppose - Its not like admins can't do all the mainspace editing they want anyway.... (Oh, and its not like the addition of a delete button means admins like, forget, what normal users are. It would also be unstable, blah de blah blah, so forth. Yeah. I kinda got bored mid-sentence. -- stercus accidit -- cjc 08:43, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :Yeah, this idea maybe isn't great, but the users want something to see we're just ordinary users (Which we are, but apparently some users just don't see it) - 15:18, May 28, 2011 (UTC)